More Prop 8 Lies Examined

I lived in Wisconsin a few years back and we had some good friends that had the same type of problem in their school. It made them very upset and they eventually had to pull their children out of school. The school refused to give them advance notice when same-sex relationships were going to be discussed in school. They would have simply kept their child home on those days. Many people, myself included, do not believe that this topic should be taught to young children. Children view their teachers and school as an authority on life and are very much influenced by what they are taught by them.

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"Prop 8 supporter bloodied outside Catholic Church in Modesto attack" This article shows which side is for intolerance. - http://iperceive.net/prop-8-supporter-bloodied-outside-catholic-church-in-modesto-attack/

The gays represent well less than 5% of our population. Yes, they have their freedom; but the line needs to be drawn. It is not in the name of intolerance that we do not want our children taught "tolerance" for gays in our public schools. To teach our children "tolerance" for gays is the same thing as saying to them, "hey, this lifestyle is ok," ... when we do not believe that to be the case.

This is a moral issue. Christians teach against sex before marriage. Teaching our children that gay is ok, is the same thing as teaching them that sex before marriage is fine. So let the gays have their rights to live how they choose, but don't let them teach our children that their choices are normal.

In California a lesbian teacher took her student class on a field trip to her lesbian wedding. When has a straight teacher ever taken their class on a field trip to a straight wedding?

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For Gays, Tolerance Can Never Subsitute For Acceptance By Reva McEachern

When people say they are tolerating you, it's probably an indication they don't like you very much, but they're forced to deal with you for one reason or another.

So when during the vice presidential debate earlier this month Republican candidate Sarah Palin said she would be tolerant of gays and lesbians, I knew what she meant.

"If there's any kind of suggestion at all from my answer that I would be anything but tolerant of adults in America choosing their partners, their relationships that they deem--uh, best for themselves--you know, I am tolerant," is what she said. What she meant was that if you are gay, you are an undesirable in this country.

I know because tolerance is a looming cloud of nonacceptance hovering over my head during holiday gatherings with my family. Tolerance forces people to hide in back alleyways and dark corners. Tolerance is "Don't ask, don't tell."

Tolerance leads to bias, which leads to intimation, which leads to violence, on ourselves or others. And with as much preparation that clearly went into Palin's reponses, I don't imagine it was by accident that she chose the word "tolerant" over "acceptance".

Before he was brutually murdered on Oct. 12, 1998, Matthew Shepard, a gay student at the University of Wyoming, could have told you a thing or two about tolerance. As could Sakia Gunn, a Newark lesbian who was stabbed to death at 15. Both were the victims of hate crimes.

As we remember them and other victims of hate crimes on this 10th anniversary of Shepard's killing by looking at the political climate for gays in America, I think it's fair to say that both Shepard and Gunn would want people to know that tolerance is not enough.

So would countless other gay, lesbian and transgender victims.

FBI statistics show that anti-gay hate crimes are the third-most frequent kind of hate crimes in America after race and religion, according to a 2006 report.

New Jersey is one of 11 states and the District of Columbia that include sexual orientation and gender identity as well as race, religion and national origin as bases for hate crimes. But federal law only covers hate crimes based on a person's race, religion and national origin.

Vice presidential candidate Joe Biden said that his ticket was for equal rights, though like the Palin-McCain ticket, Biden and Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama denounce gay marriage in respect of traditional values.

Well, I disagree that pushing tradtional values is a realistic means to improve the quality of life for most people in America, gay straight, or otherwise. Harkening to tradition does not in any way represent a tide of change to me.

I wish that gay people would take the time necessary to discuss openly and truly understand the complexity of our sexual identities instead of offering straight people an explanation that will make sense within their heterosexual perception of the world.

I wish we would stop giving them the standardized response that it is not a choice. I wish we would stop implying that being gay is wrong, but that you can't blame us poor gay people who are victims of chance.

I wish we would stop putting ourselves into boxes, and boxes within boxes, and then begging for tolerance rather than demanding acceptance.

The truth is that there are as many ways of being gay as there are gay people. So I don't want to hear about traditional values and assimiliation, and I couldn't care less about marriage vs. civil unions if you would just give me the same 1,049 benifits and protections available to heterosexual couples.

I want to hear politicians talk about fundamental values, like love, peace and happiness--not offer bipartisan rhetoric or appeal to Middle America. I am not Middle America. I am not a soccer mom. I am not a single parent. I am not a community organizer or a coal miner's daughter. And I am certainly not traditional.

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Undecided on Prop 8??? Consider that to tolerate is not the same thing as to condone. Tolerance is a lens through which we should view all people, including gay and lesbian people. We cannot and should not condone all actions. You can love people without loving what they do.

Voting Yes on Prop 8 is a vote for tolerance. Voting Yes on 8 guarantees that rights will be preserved for traditional marriages and for domestic partnerships. Voting Yes on Prop 8 is NOT intolerant, bigoted, or discriminatory. Please vote YES on Prop 8!

http://www.protectmarriage.com/ www.whatisprop8.com http://concernedincalifornia.blogspot.com/

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Prop 8 will eventually eliminate marriage for everyone, if it passes. The State Supreme Court pretty clearly telegraphed what would have to be done if California tried to reserve "marriage" to a single group of people. It'd have to be taken away and all marriages converted to civil unions. I quote:

When a statute’s differential treatment of separate categories of individuals is found to violate equal protection principles, a court must determine whether the constitutional violation should be eliminated or cured by extending to the previously excluded class the treatment or benefit that the statute affords to the included class, or alternatively should be remedied by withholding the benefit equally from both the previously included class and the excluded class. A court generally makes that determination by considering whether extending the benefit equally to both classes, or instead withholding it equally, would be most consistent with the likely intent of the Legislature, had that body recognized that unequal treatment was constitutionally impermissible. [. . .] In the present case, it is readily apparent that extending the designation of marriage to same-sex couples clearly is more consistent with the probable legislative intent than withholding that designation from both opposite-sex couples and same-sex couples in favor of some other, uniform designation. In view of the lengthy history of the use of the term "marriage" to describe the family relationship here at issue, and the importance that both the supporters of the 1977 amendment to the marriage statutes and the electors who voted in favor of Proposition 22 unquestionably attached to the designation of marriage, there can be no doubt that extending the designation of marriage to same-sex couples, rather than denying it to all couples, is the equal protection remedy that is most consistent with our state’s general legislative policy and preference.

The SC chose the more expedient route of saying "These rights apply to all comers, gay or straight, and it would be a real hassle to change everything to 'civil union,' so gays also have the right to marry. That's the easiest, least expensive route to take, here." However, they did say what the other option was: withholding that designation from both opposite-sex couples and same-sex couples in favor of some other, uniform designation. That's what you are toying with, by trying to pass Prop 8. It would result in the Supreme Court saying "Okay, we have NO marriages in California. They're all civil unions." That would also have the effect of making it impossible for anyone in California who is civilly unioned to claim marriage exemptions on their federal taxes.

If you believe the people supporting Proposition 8, you are being tricked.

VOTE NO ON 8. It's the right thing to do.

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Schools will not be required to teach anything to your children about homosexuality. The law already gives parents the right to take their children out of any health or sex ed class that might offend the parents.

That canard about grade-schoolers being "forced" to attend their teacher's same-sex wedding is just that, a canard. One of the parents of a child in that class organized a valid field trip, which required valid permission slips signed by parents, for the children to attend their teacher's wedding to surprise her. Several children's parents did not sign permission slips. Those children stayed at school in another classroom, just like they would for any other field trip where their parents did not give permission for them to go.

If you believe the people supporting Proposition 8, you are being tricked.

VOTE NO ON 8. It's the right thing to do.

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To be fair, both sides are playing politics and advertising is showing both sides as extremists. To give a view from another direction, I usually look for issues affecting children and that impacts how I make a lot of my decisions.

The United Nations Rights of the Child Convention, Article 7, says that a child has the right, whenever possible, to know and be raised by their parents. Others talk of this as the right of a child to bond with their natural mother and father. While this isn't always possible, society should promote it as the ideal because it's the best for the child.

Because I feel children's rights need to be protected above some others, I'm voting yes on 8.

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So you support abolishing marriage rights for adoptive and foster parents of the opposite-sex I assume, right Ken? Otherwise your position makes no sense and your motivations lie elsewhere.

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